FISA

The place to discuss issues being debated in the 2009-2010 school year -- briefs, legislation and debate.

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bromano
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Re: FISA

Postby bromano » Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:37 pm

Over all, I pretty much agree with this bill. The various acts mentioned in it are a violation of the 4th amendment, because they allow the government to destroy your security. The 4th amendment reads "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects,against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause," This means that the government has no right to come in and tap your phones without viable cause. The recent "security" acts do nothing that they are supposed to. They, instead of protecting US citizens, destroy their rights, and allow the federal government to butcher their rights. This bill is completely in line, and does something that should have been done long ago.

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VSharma
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Re: FISA

Postby VSharma » Tue Jan 05, 2010 9:44 pm

Technically, everyone is right that FISA violates people's rights in the 4th amendment. However, due to the elastic clause, the several acs passed such as FISA, the Patriot Act, etc. are not unconstitutional. So, the violation of the 4th amendment is not a valid argument unless someone wanted to complain about the elastic clause. But then, that is a different topic and should not be mentioned in detail at this meeting. Overall, i do not agree with this bill and people cannot judge that the government does not have valid reasons to intrude citizens' privacy such as Senator Bromano did without providing the body with an actual case.

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VSharma
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Re: FISA

Postby VSharma » Tue Jan 05, 2010 10:23 pm

-even though the government or organizations such as NSA (research it) do not necessarily use a legal warrant, they still have to proceed through a cycle of providing a written application of:
who they will survey, justification for surveillance, type of communication and who's communication is going to be surveyed, duration of investigation/ eves drop, etc

- also, under FISA, the president does not have to create warants only if the targets of the communication interceptions are non-Us citizen. Due to this, Us citizens' rights of the 4th amendment are not being intruded( i take back what i said earlier about FISA being a violation of the 4th amendment).

mlind
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Re: FISA

Postby mlind » Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:38 pm

VSharma wrote:Technically, everyone is right that FISA violates people's rights in the 4th amendment. However, due to the elastic clause, the several acs passed such as FISA, the Patriot Act, etc. are not unconstitutional. So, the violation of the 4th amendment is not a valid argument unless someone wanted to complain about the elastic clause. But then, that is a different topic and should not be mentioned in detail at this meeting. Overall, i do not agree with this bill and people cannot judge that the government does not have valid reasons to intrude citizens' privacy such as Senator Bromano did without providing the body with an actual case.

The Elastic Clause is used to give Congress powers beyond the enumerated ones. It doesn't let you circumvent the 4th amendment.

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galukal
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Re: FISA

Postby galukal » Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:36 pm

Well, someone suddenly seems to like the Constitution. How about those Ninth and 10th Amendments, huh?


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